To gank or not to gank .... [Archive] - DarkSpear Horde Forums

Ominus

09-05-2006, 02:25 PM

We had this nice little conversation in Guild Chat and I thought I would carry it forward here.

Aaggro and I have alliance characters on Kargath (PvE server) and decided we wanted to try the other side. We decided to make our next WoW experience totally different and went with horde characters on a PvP server. So far its been a really fun twist on things we have already done. There is enough difference between the two factions that it makes things really fresh. The only thing that sucks is the ganking. It's not so horrible that it makes me want to quit. I can't say that leveling is significantly harder on this server then it was on Kargath, but the ganking does get in the way at times.

I have admit I was pretty naieve about what went on in a PvP server. I had some notion of equals meeting on the field of battle. That has happened a few times. I'll see some alliance guy, he see's me, and we both say WTF and charge at each other. I love that stuff. That happens rarely though. What I have found more of is the opposing faction waiting till I am at 1/4 health from fighting an NPC and then attacking me. Even worse then that is guys 10, 20, and 30 levels higher then me just running around and killing me, and then camping my body. WTF is up with that?

I just don't understand the point of ganking. My personal opinion is all you are really doing is causing some grief to another human being. If that kind of stuff makes you happy, you have something wrong with you. The fact that I came from a PvE server isn't influencing my opinion. At a personal level, I just don't get it.

Ragz

09-05-2006, 02:49 PM

Ganking for the most part I tolerate to some extent (I have an extreme hatred for the stranglethorn zone)...corpse camping is another issue totaly. When this happens make a call out in guild. There are plenty of us that are being bored 60's that will come to make the campers lives a bit more hectic.

Just remember the motto....red is ded :blackeye:

Mackadoody

09-05-2006, 02:55 PM

A lot of the guys here leveled toons to 60 on a PvE server... Gilneas.

All I can say is this... ganking is all about the opportunity... for the most part, I'm a carebear... Leave me alone, and I'll leave you alone. This has bitten me in the ass a few times, so it's not a rule of thumb.

I think it comes down to some players taking joy in griefing other players... and others relishing in taking revenge on the griefers... and still others who can't get revenge on the griefers who take it out on other lowbies.

I remember getting griefed by a 60 hunter one evening when I tried to catch Broken Tooth as a pet. The hunter ganked me, killed the MoB, and camped there to dance and laugh at me when I rezzed, and ganked me again.

Made me log on the mage, and look for him... I didn't find him, but I took my frustrations ot on some lowbies... and I probably won't feel guilty if someone's trying to do their Rok'Ledar quest, and I go in and Fire Blast the demon to make him despawn... because I know someone will try to do it to any of us.

Makes it challenging.

Bailek

09-05-2006, 03:02 PM

As far as ganking goes, I wont corpse camp or anything but when im farming herbs in stv and come across a lowbie, Ill kill it. The thing I like about it is when that person calls for help and some 60 tries to come be the hero and I kill him too. Attracting players of my level to compete in world pvp is really the only reason I might gank. No fun left in battlegrounds, cant even develop rivalries with players of the opposing faction cause youre lucky to recognize anyone in there anymore :(

xeno

09-05-2006, 03:44 PM

right now, i generally go by the "live & let live" motto, but that's because my main is only level 40 and i'm more interested in leveling up ASAP! however, "red = dead" when i'm not solo or i've feel the urge to gank :)

ganking, imho, is more of a revenge thing than anything else. you can't make it to 60 (on a pvp server) without getting ganked many times. i guess some people have gotten ganked more than others, need anger management or they just simply enjoy pissing people off.

-Xalyc-

09-05-2006, 03:51 PM

If its red, its dead. PvP happens on a PvP server. Lvl 1...lvl 60...doesnt matter. They kill us, we kill them. There is not such thing as fair or not.

Mackadoody

09-05-2006, 03:58 PM

OMG,

Wait until you see the nightmare that is known as Blackrock Mountain.... It looks like the garbage dumpster of a bar on Buffalo Wing night.

Bones bones bones....

And mostly alliance camping the entrances.... they seem to be more bored than us Hordies.

-Xalyc-

09-05-2006, 04:12 PM

The alliance on this server give no, to very little consideration to us in any situation. Like many, I used to have a 'defensive' stance on things. I only fought when attacked...left others alone, etc. Then I switched to Horde, came to Darkspear and came to the fact that the more I second guess myself if I should attack or not...the more I find myself in situation where I am unsure of my actions. I focused on rather than thinking of how to avoid a fight, or how to prepare for a ganking, I rolled on the offensive. I win about 95% of my fights, and I am not talking about the piles of undergeared 60's nor the lowbies I storm through. What I am saying is in many situations by the time you see an enemy, he has seen you. Who acts first will almost always determine the outcome. The more you question 'should I?', the more you may find yourself running back to your corpse. This is the same thought process taught to military troops, especially the Marines. The moment you hesitate, is the moment your dead. Being military, I could not agree more. I gank alot. Lowbies, 60's, well geared or not. I loose a few here and there...but most of the time its due to being outnumbered, or sometimes I just get stupid. I gank lowbies not to be an asshole (even though I have no problem admitting I am). I gank lowbies to protect the horde lowbies...to maintain a pressence so out guys can lvl in peace....to remind the alliance they need to be afraid, and maybe motivate them to move on the other grounds. Most of my gank areas I visit are frequent areas the alliance like to gank horde. Same may thing 'Well, if we leave them alone, the won't attack us'....that is a pipe dream. Even if they didnt kill you, they most likely told someone your there, and they will.

Uwe

09-05-2006, 04:15 PM

I share the same idea as Mack, even if its an equal level, if they leave me alone, I'll leave them alone.
HOWEVER
Ive been attacked before while killing mobs, so, I try to rez, hide and kill that sunofa--. Now, if its a group that camps, taunts and is just generally being an ass about it. I feel no remorse asking for some help from CKB. They will GLADLY put an alliance in his/her place just because we can.

I'm not one to utterly destroy lowbies. If i seel them, depending on my mood, i might take them out. But the thing thats fun to me, is running up to the lowbie, act all "im level 60" intimidating, see if they squirm/beg/run. If they do, ill run them down, and wave.... then leave them alone.

I'm wierd like that.

As for blackrock mountain, if your going in there with 5 or 10 people, pray to whatever god you pray to that there isnt an alliance guild prepping for MC or BWL, cause you WILL get run down and slaughtered. We've waited it out or went another way.

I personally love PvP servers better than the cookie cutter "do the quests" PvE server. Ganking/PvP gives a little spice to the game.

Sorry for the long post...

Melent

09-05-2006, 04:28 PM

I had some notion of equals meeting on the field of battle. That has happened a few times.

In any war based gaming environment, this simply does not happen. For those that haven't played in this environment, the reality of the situation is like a cold bucket of water. PvP/Warfare environments are chaotic and most of the time, unfair. That's why I feel that my "red name, dead name" approach, in most situations, is the one that works best.

What I have found more of is the opposing faction waiting till I am at 1/4 health from fighting an NPC and then attacking me. Even worse then that is guys 10, 20, and 30 levels higher then me just running around and killing me, and then camping my body. WTF is up with that?

Read "The Art of War" by Sun Tzu. It is the guide to waging warfare and has been the guidebook for centuries (millenia?). Remember, the goal is to win and not make it challenging for both parties. You want to win by overwhelming force, catching your enemy with their skivvies around their ankle, etc.

I just don't understand the point of ganking. My personal opinion is all you are really doing is causing some grief to another human being. If that kind of stuff makes you happy, you have something wrong with you. The fact that I came from a PvE server isn't influencing my opinion. At a personal level, I just don't get it.

Actually, it is a difference in mind set and there is nothing wrong with either side. It's a different setting with different rules. Adapt or die. :crazy:

The thing to keep in mind is that PvP/warfare games are chaotic and self policing environments. The counter to you being camped by an alliance is to have the bored level 60s (which I happen to be, more times than not) to come out and turn the situation around on the miscreant. Ask in guild chat and you may soon see a large number of CkB respond. It's happened many times before and will happen again. ;)

Aaggro

09-05-2006, 04:48 PM

and KILL ALL ROGUES ON SITE! Sneaky little bastages!

One Tier2 acutally stealthed into the middle of Grom Gol just to kill me. I fee honored. :smile2:

-Xalyc-

09-05-2006, 04:49 PM

Melent...I want to have your babiez....you mentioned Sun Tzu

Ragz

09-05-2006, 05:15 PM

Sun Tzu is a FREAKING WIMP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Duke Nukem....now there is a hero.......wheres my rpg :crazy: :blackeye:

Kenshino

09-05-2006, 05:25 PM

One of the main things I love about this game is the ideaa of the ongoing war, I just kill anything and everything I can haha =P.

Ominus

09-05-2006, 05:31 PM

I have read The Art of War. Sun Tzu was a pretty thoughtful dude and I doubt he would equate his tactics on war with a game. I have been eager to help others out, regardless of faction when ever they were in need. These are just other people trying to have a little fun in their spare time. It isn't a war. However, Blizzard has designed the PvP servers with the same kind of challenges (race, color, language, geography, etc..) in place that make a lot of other humans hate each other. Being on a PvP server feels like a socialism experiment that is bringing out both the best and worst in people. The Horde and Alliance have no common goals, and frequently have competing goals. Rather then live and let live, we just gank each other.

If that is the attitude, then I will adapt. I have been bitten in the ass too many times lately to hold on to a concept for a game.

TotalCarnage

09-05-2006, 05:45 PM

I used to be a live and live kind of guy...until I got to STV. Then the gankings got me to the point where I knew that when it was my turn I'd be doling it out. Hell, I'll fight underlevel if I have to, knowing full well I can bring in an ass whipping if necessary. Currently I have two accounts. One that has my 60 warrior and my 40 mage and one that has a 60 Rogue. Lately I findmyself putting the mage on follow of the Stealthed rogue and ganking idiots thinking they are getting a freebee.

One thing you can be assured of is that people know we will fight back. As a result wearing CkB tags can get you attacked. The bonus is that if we aren't tied up all you have to do is put the word out in guild and odds are a ganking squad will show up. We frequently steamroll larger numbers of Alliance. In many cases the only way they can get us out of a zone is to bring in significantly more people.

We do get accused of "zerging". However, I just considering that showing up to win. You want a fair fight ask for one and I'll meet you someplace. Otherwise prepare to get your ass kicked. Eventually you'll get past the annoyance and once you have a 60 hanging out someplace you'll end up like me ganking people who ganked your lowbie toon. so much so, you level slowly :)

-Xalyc-

09-05-2006, 05:46 PM

To each his own man. We each pay our $15 to play this game, and if someone wants to spend there time picking flowers and fishing, then so be it. However, being passive can often lead to a corpse run. We are all fighting on the same side, with the same goals in mind. I will always be a fighter, and a ganker. Even though there have been several times some Horde have sat and watched lowbies get ganked...or ride by when someone is faced by overwhelming odds. I will always jump in the fight reguardless if someone would be willing to do the same for me. There will be many times you will try and gank someone, or have a good fight...and get owned...thats just part of the game. You learn from your fights, and try and better. I have been camped more times than I can remember.

Euroranger

09-05-2006, 05:51 PM

Well, speaking for myself, my gank tendencies run the gamut from "live and let live" to "red = dead". If I'm ganking, it's likely gonna be as some sort of revenge or lesson. That said, I don't consider hitting any level 60 alliance character as "ganking"...especially if it's 1v1.

I have been known to gank lower level characters but usually only after they have come to farm something I'm already farming and there isn't enough to go around...and they've ignored a few /shoo emotes. I subscribe to the "might makes right" philosophy...especially after I've invited them to leave. I'll kill suspected bots or gold-farmers on sight though...just out of principle.

One of the most rewarding things about being in CkB though is that we are widely known to the snivelling Alliance masses as a guild who looks out for our own. I believe that simply by virtue of having the "Cabal KaBob" guild ID over my head that I've both received and been spared PvP battle...and haven't been camped by anyone in quite some time unless they were in a large, well-geared group. They tend to know what's coming for them if they try. :D

But as for ganking as a pastime, yeah, get used to it. It is a game based on warfare and warfare per the Marquis of Queensbury rules is for suckers. Strong > weak. Healthy > hurt. Phat g3@r > no gear.

It's a fight...go hard or go home.

/my 2 cents (2.71 cents CDN)

Mackadoody

09-05-2006, 05:54 PM

I have been surprised every once in a while...

Last night, I'm farming Elemental Earth in the Badlands...
I'd just doing my thing... collecting elementals then killing them... Across comes a few lvl 40-45 alliance and an undergeared 60 mage... watching me collect 7-8 the elementals in the area, and kill them in 1/4 my mana pool.
They watched, they waved... I left them alone, they left me alone.

I ran across some lvl 40 mage AoE grinding the humanoid things... was doing GREAT, I might add.... I helped it... /clapped and /cheered, got a /thanks... that was cool.

I was on my hunter in Silithus, on the road, doing some lvl 58 quest at lvl 54... Infamous hunter dismounts, stands next to me, and watches my pet on some bug. I /waved, went back to shooting... 19 of his guildmates show up... I get MC'd, and Prayer for Fortituded, and they leave.
I so thought I was dead.

Dokar

09-05-2006, 06:03 PM

I
I was on my hunter in Silithus, on the road, doing some lvl 58 quest at lvl 54... Infamous hunter dismounts, stands next to me, and watches my pet on some bug. I /waved, went back to shooting... 19 of his guildmates show up... I get MC'd, and Prayer for Fortituded, and they leave.
I so thought I was dead.

Those are always fun.

When the valentines quests were up, I was riding through the plaguelands on doogie (mid-level 50s at the time, with lousy gear), and a geared-out paladin on an epic mount starts chasing me down the road. Whatever. I've been ganked before, so I just kept riding. He dismounts, hits me with hammer of justice...and then cures my "heartbroken" debuff with a friendship bracelet. /wave. Rode away.

I bout fell out of my chair laughing. :)

But ya, get a bunch of idiots giving you camping grief, just say so. The Wrath of the Cabal is painful. :crazy:

Ragz

09-05-2006, 06:04 PM

The Wrath of the Cabal is painful. :crazy:

Oh hell yeah this is my new sig.....

Vorgra

09-05-2006, 06:11 PM

I was on my hunter in Silithus, on the road, doing some lvl 58 quest at lvl 54... Infamous hunter dismounts, stands next to me, and watches my pet on some bug. I /waved, went back to shooting... 19 of his guildmates show up... I get MC'd, and Prayer for Fortituded, and they leave.
I so thought I was dead.

I had this happen to my Warlock in the Plaguelands by a Ruin or Icon priest...or one of the others we have a war with :smile2: . I was alone right past the cave and saw the two of them coming...got MC'd and was like shit its a long run back to here...PoF ftw baby!!! But so not the norm.

Vandal

09-05-2006, 07:03 PM

Ill gank if i dont like the guy, If i know i can own them with my eyes closed ill wait for them to hit me and then show them that they are nothing but another notch in my belt.

Perfect example-yesterday i was running by a full tier 2 mage and 51 rogue. I sat there and watched them for a sec and saw the mage queing up a fire ball, i was about to run and i get stun locked by the 51 rogue. Now im mad, not that they killed me, but they suck and the only way the mage killed me is because i was stunlocked. So i rez one shot the rogue and now its me and the mage, I pretty much flawlessed him, he got 1 fire blast on me cause he was trying to sheep me but i know how to pvp and save the earthshock to cancel a sheep, then grounding totem so he cant silence and CL him, he kept trying to sheep me-he dies. Killed him 3 times to let him know that he sucks and i was gonna let him go, but he thought he was all good in his tier 2 but then got owned like hardcore in the face.

Mackadoody

09-05-2006, 07:14 PM

Vandal... a well played 55 Shammy can pwn a tier 2 mage... whaddaya talkin' about?

nerf shaman! :p

-Xalyc-

09-05-2006, 07:45 PM

Vandal... a well played 55 Shammy can pwn a tier 2 mage... whaddaya talkin' about?

nerf shaman! :p

Only if he is a complete nub. A well timed counterspell can ruin our day.

Vandal

09-05-2006, 07:58 PM

Vandal... a well played 55 Shammy can pwn a tier 2 mage... whaddaya talkin' about?

nerf shaman! :p

let me know how that goes, if you win ill give you my acccount.

Mackadoody

09-05-2006, 08:00 PM

let me know how that goes, if you win ill give you my acccount.

Huh?

raideromega

09-06-2006, 03:06 AM

yall are a bunch of softies :)

i kill everything

i was like TC. till STV. complete u turn right there. LvL 30s- I got REALLY good at running from people, even mounted people. using the terrain to out manuver and escape/find refuge. lvl 40s- I got REALLY REALLY good at killing. I can honestly only remember getting beaten bad 1v1 (as in we were both full health at the start and below 6 or 7 lvls above me) by a shadow priest from my lvling from like 42 till 54(im sure there was atleast one other tho). but unlike most people, my 42 to 54 was not spent leveling. i quested with the purpose to find and kill on the way, my quest was a secondary objective. So basicly i always ran around in hunt mode. 55-60 i kinda did quicker than my other levels. dont remember much pvp then. but at early 60 my ganking career blossomed.

pre epic 60-I SHOULD have spent all my world pvp time in the BGs like my 'peers', i could have easily gotten general or warlord with my time spent playing; gotten the 90g epic and the status ect. but nooo. i had to farm as much gold as i could for a standard epic and then barley make it to stoneguard from the world pvp.... but i got good at it. used my running away skill oppositly and hunted people

epic mounted 60- bgs, killing. never really a victim. i think i must have only been CCed mabey 3 times in a row, of course theyve tried more, but ive either killed them myself or the CKB welcome wagon came to drop off a load :evil:

now i just ride around with the "whatever" attitude. I only gank when in the mood. if someone can get me while im unsuspectingly farming or something and actually kill me(pretty rare) then i deserve(d) it.

and ofcourse numbers change everything. so does gear. class. time of day. what you ate for lunch. if you've found a penny that day.........

Wez

09-06-2006, 01:43 PM

Vandal, after playing my Alliance priest against Shaman recently, I have to say that Shaman are pure ownage in PvP. I didn't realize that you can purge all their buffs and walk around frostshocking ppl who try to run from you. Can you guys purge debuffs off yourself as well? I assume you can, so basically you guys wear mail, can decurse like priests, heal, do dps either melee or spell and lets not get started on those totems. When I die I hope I come back as a Shaman. 8)

Durzen

09-06-2006, 02:58 PM

Ha! great stories folks!
Red it's dead mode for me!
Last night in Azshara, timber maw camps. Alli priest show's up and bubbles starts to loot a chest,timbermaw's go after her but bubble FTW! Now I am of descent faction to not get attack by the timbermaw's so being stealth lvl 55 I go for it! She would not hesitate to have killed me on the spot had she seen me.
Bubble wears off and a new one's about to go up.
Stunlock FTW, Cheapshot, no bubble timbermaw's and I are ripping her apart.
Then comes Kidney shot and sh'e stunned for yet another 6 seconds. gets a fear off at the end but dies! freakin funny as hell!
I know she's pissed too! so I wait around for a bit, and low and behold there's a lvl 52 rogue trying to do his rogue quest. She pops thinking he's me and chase him down, sprint after her and do it again! too damn funny!
Had to have pissed her off completely! Red == Dead!

-Xalyc-

09-06-2006, 03:14 PM

Can you guys purge debuffs off yourself as well? I assume you can, so basically you guys wear mail, can decurse like priests, heal, do dps either melee or spell and lets not get started on those totems. When I die I hope I come back as a Shaman. 8)

No, we can only purge, which removes 2 buffs from our target, but it doesnt work aganst everything. We can remove poison and disease. The defensive version of our purge is a little spell called Cleanse, that Pally's have..its removes 1 disease, 1 poison, and 1 magic (total 3) from himself, or who he casts it on(EDIT: This spell has always largly been the big difference between Alliance vs Horde in PvE. Cleanse keeps healers healing rather than dispelling, etc.) Now, between melee and spell damage often depends on the spec and gear, and there are really only 3-4 totems worth a damn in PvP, and even those are not that great.

A priest can be a very hard fight (even holy spec). Put silence on your spell bar and you will never have any problems winning.

Uwe

09-06-2006, 04:26 PM

Duke Nukem....now there is a hero.......wheres my rpg :crazy: :blackeye:

Definatly one of the best game heros EVER.

Durzen

09-06-2006, 04:40 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ragz
Duke Nukem....now there is a hero.......wheres my rpg :crazy: :blackeye:

Definatly one of the best game heros EVER.

What are you waiting for? Christmas!
Shake it baby!
Come get some!
That's gotta hurt!
Hail to the King Baby!
Groovy!
It's time to kick ass and chew bubble gum, and I'm all outta gum!

I loved this game! wonder why the boy likes it too? hehehe!

Wez

09-06-2006, 04:47 PM

(EDIT: This spell has always largly been the big difference between Alliance vs Horde in PvE. Cleanse keeps healers healing rather than dispelling, etc.)

I would say the plate makes a difference to, that and the insane Pally buffs that are not subject to staying in range of a totem and live beyond the Pallys death. you get 3 or more Pallies in a raid and everyone in the raid has sick buffs that stay up the whole time and don't use time and mana to recast during fights. Baisically take your totems effects and give them to everybody and forget about having to drop anymore totems.

Ominus

09-06-2006, 04:49 PM

We need a That's gotta hurt emote

The Horde get Pally's in the XP. No more whining about Alliance EZ mode.

Uwe

09-06-2006, 04:50 PM

Probably cause of the strippers....uh... i mean the great gameplay and weapons...yeah... thats it :crazy:

And you forgot a good quote

"Those alien bastards are going to pay for shooting up my ride!"

http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Duke_Nukem

:smile2:

Mackadoody

09-06-2006, 04:54 PM

We need a That's gotta hurt emote

The Horde get Pally's in the XP. No more whining about Alliance EZ mode.

I remember you guys were stuck at Razorgore for a while.... what do you guys do to get past that fight now? You guys always complained that the grounding totems were Horde EZ mode

-Xalyc-

09-06-2006, 05:15 PM

I remember you guys were stuck at Razorgore for a while.... what do you guys do to get past that fight now? You guys always complained that the grounding totems were Horde EZ mode

Earthbind Totem is the one I think you are speaking of.

Ominus

09-06-2006, 06:04 PM

I remember you guys were stuck at Razorgore for a while.... what do you guys do to get past that fight now? You guys always complained that the grounding totems were Horde EZ mode

We found a new guild with better players. However, we didn't leave for that reason, the guild fell apart.

Abigorr

09-06-2006, 07:44 PM

gank those alliance infedels show them that the horde shows no mercy even kill there younglings :crazy:

MiCKalaus

09-10-2006, 12:58 PM

To gank, or not to gank: that is the question:
Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer
The slings and arrows of outrageous fortune,
Or to take arms against a sea of alliance ganker,
And by opposing end them? To die: to log;
No more; and by logging to say we end
The heart-ache and the thousand natural shocks
That flesh is heir to, 'tis a consummation
Devoutly to be wish'd. To die, to log;
To log: perchance to pull a 60 out: ay, there's the rub;
For in that logging of death what alli's may come
When we have shuffled off this lowbie coil,
Must give us pause: there's the respect
That makes calamity of so long life;
For who would bear the whips and scorns of time, (or lock pets?)
The alliance's wrong, the proud man's contumely,
The pangs of despised gankers, the lag's delay,
The insolence of fanboys and the spurns
That carebear merit of the unworthy takes,
When he himself might his quietus make
With a bare guild tabard? who would fardels bear,(DRUIDS!)
To grunt (or what ever your rank is) and sweat under a weary grind,
But that the dread of something after death,(CAMP'age)
The undiscover'd country (next lvling grounds) from whose bourn
No traveller returns (Stv), puzzles the will (General: who's got [stv pages]?)
And makes us rather bear(just druids!) those ills we have (Alliance)
Than fly to others that we know not of? (did i get the Fp?... CHIT!)
Thus conscience does make cowards of us all;(just the lowbies...RUN AWAY!)
And thus the native hue of resolution (LOG THE 60 IN!)
Is sicklied o'er with the pale cast (TALAZ OR LUC) of thought,
And enterprises of great pith and moment (loging in the 60)
With this regard their currents turn awry, (why i love Tal or Luc, oh and Xalyc)
And lose the name of action.--Soft you now! (DEAD ALLI's)
The fair (PRT SCR)! Nymph, in thy orisons
Be all my sins remember'd.

well if ya made it down here KILL EM ALL LET THE GM's SORT'UM OUT!

Mackadoody

09-10-2006, 07:45 PM